"There is no hope"

[dwgm]

Watching CNN. Apparently Pope John Paul II isn't dead yet, but soon will be. Not unexpected, of course.

My daughters have never known a time when he wasn't Pope. He was elected in 1978.

Does anyone remember the first John Paul, the saintly man that was Pope for such a very short time? I dreamt of his death the night before it happened. Not a coincidence: I've had precognitive dreams a couple of other times in my life. Kinda weird and scary.

It'll be interesting to see what changes, and what stays the same.

Comments

[cjk1701.livejournal.com]

I hope whoever is the next pope is a bit more liberal on issues such as birth and STD control methods. Female and married priests is an important issue, but possibly overshadowed by the fate of millions of people who could avoid an AIDS infection if the church changed its stance somewhat.

Also, there's a huge amount of South American cardinals in the list of likely candidates. I wonder who the next guy will be, it will be cautiously interesting.

[geekmama.livejournal.com]

Also, there's a huge amount of South American cardinals in the list of likely candidates. I wonder who the next guy will be

They'll probably go back to an Italian, since communism isn't such an issue in Europe any more. I'm not saying that's good or bad. I just suspect that seems like the reality of the situation to me. But, yes, it will be interesting to see who they pick.

The issues surrounding human sexuality are so complicated. It's no wonder they want to simplify things by saying No sex outside of marriage, period. Unfortunately, that doesn't seem to work too well.

[whitemunin.livejournal.com]

I remember the first John Paul. I was only 8 or 9 at the time, but I can still picture him very clearly. Small, slim guy. Gray hair and glasses. Rode his bike all over the place. Funny. I don't know why he made such a strong impression on me, but I've never forgotten him.

[geekmama.livejournal.com]

He was only Pope for 33 days, and the Vatican bungled the reports of his death, causing conspiracy theories to spring up. He did make quite an impression during that short time, though.

[celandineb.livejournal.com]

I remember him only because of the big deal that JPII chose to use the same papal name as a kind of homage.

It will definitely be interesting to see what happens next... I'm not Catholic but since I teach medieval history I know a reasonable amount about the medieval church and its popes. Some were good, some bad, some indifferent, like every other human being (the latter-day doctrine of papal infallibility notwithstanding).

[geekmama.livejournal.com]

the latter-day doctrine of papal infallibility notwithstanding

Papal infallibility applies only to his ex cathedra pronouncements, of course. It doesn't mean he's sinless, or even always correct.

[celandineb.livejournal.com]

I know, but I have no truck with that doctrine regardless... :-)

[geekmama.livejournal.com]

I wouldn't think so, being a non-Catholic. But a lot of people don't know how limited the doctrine is.

[cymbeline.livejournal.com]

I'm not Catholic but I'll be sad with his passing. He's been pope through most of my lifetime so he's what I think of when there is any mention of the Vatican, Pope, etc.

[geekmama.livejournal.com]

Yes. Twenty-seven years is a long time.

I didn't always agree with his position on all issues, but I think he did the best he could and that his heart was in the right place. I know there are lots of people who won't agree with that assessment, though. He was the product of a particular generation, and raised in a particular belief system. Then, too, as Pope, he always had to see things over the long term, and in the light of history. You can't please all the people all the time.

[cymbeline.livejournal.com]

I think he did the best he could.

crud my 2 year old just broke a bowl on the kitchen floor...

[katalynn.livejournal.com]

Slightly on subject, but not completely.

I read a book a while back by Andrew Greely, which dealt with the naming of a new pope. I foudn it facinating, since I am not catholic and have little knowledge. It was very interesting to see what Greely thought might happen. I might have to reread the book and see how right he is.

If I'm correct, Greely is a retired catholic priest. Though he might not be retired. Honestly not sure.

[geekmama.livejournal.com]

I'm not sure he's retired. I've read a lot of his books, and I believe "White Smoke", which is the one to which I believe you are referring, was the first. It was a good one!

Morris West's "Pope Trilogy" (Shoes of the Fisherman, The Clowns of God, and Lazarus) is great, too.

How are you doing? Did you already move?

[katalynn.livejournal.com]

Already made it. Got butt chewed by Amy last night for not letting her know sooner, but we only ot phone and internet yesterday.. so I apologized and made weak sorry noises and she accepted and so on. =)

Called and spoke to drmrow this morning and let him know the new number and that I'm here safely.

Lovely skies.. =) I will have to go get the book, now that I've got the name. =) As well as the others you mentioned, since I've never read those. Yay!!! More things to pass the time.

Oh, I'm thinking of writing about the things that have happened in the last year. If/when I get up the nerve to, I wanted to ask you and ladymo as well as a couple others who will understand, to proof read and give feedback on it. Interested?

[geekmama.livejournal.com]

Glad to know you are there and getting settled in.

I'd be glad to proofread, and give feedback too. It's always good to have more than one editor--I have a couple that are kind enough to help me with my stories, and they often have separate but equally valid suggestions on improving the work.

[gingersnapps.livejournal.com]

Sorry about the premature message on your cel. The news reported it and you were the first person to pop into my pointy little head that I wanted to talk with.

[geekmama.livejournal.com]

That's OK! I wouldn't have turned on the TV, otherwise. Apparently reports of his death were greatly exaggerated.

It won't be too long, though.

[gingersnapps.livejournal.com]

Sad isn't it. The end of an era.

[geekmama.livejournal.com]

Yes. But the poor man has been suffering for quite a while now, and he has never spared himself, in spite of it. Time for him to rest, finally, it seems.

[ballincollig.livejournal.com]

I'm quite broken up about the poor man. I watched one grandmother die of Parkinson's, and it was terrible. Dehumanizing.

It is comforting to consider the joy he must feel being co close to reunion with his God. I am trying to think of that, for his sake.

[geekmama.livejournal.com]

My father had Parkinsons, although it was cancer that finally killed him. He, like this Pope, never spared himself, and was active as possible until the last couple weeks of his life.

But yes, ultimately he must be happy that he will soon be resting with God.